suspension and tracking | General Chat | GBS Owners Club
Avatar

Please consider registering
guest

sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register

Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search

— Forum Scope —




— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

sp_Feed Topic RSS sp_TopicIcon
suspension and tracking
January 3, 2018
3:54 pm
Avatar
Weazel134
Bedford
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 17
Member Since:
September 15, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

went out for a cold winters drive yesterday and noticed things got a little skitish. now this was mostly due to the wet road surface. i want to check my suspension level is correct, tracking is adjusted right, suspension hardness/softness etc etc......

i read before in a previous post but can't find it..??

suspension height?

tracking toe in? toe out?

thanks in advance.

Dan

January 3, 2018
6:49 pm
Avatar
Mitch
Gloucester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 406
Member Since:
April 18, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Ive had a search of the forum and cant find it either. Im sure its 2 degrees toe in but not sure. Im sure Simon will be along any minute.

Be interesting to see as I'm booking a mobile tracking company this week as mine is out by a visible amount and GBS cant will take 5-6 hours to do it?!?!? so cant do it on the Pre IVA in a few weeks.

January 3, 2018
7:00 pm
Avatar
Marlin
Willits, California, USA
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 178
Member Since:
July 30, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

110mm front, 120mm rear if I remember right.
1* toe-in
from "FRONT/REAR GEOMETERY FIGURES. | TECHNICAL TALK | GBS OWNERS CLUB" using search
http://www.gbsownersclub.co.uk.....y-figures/

Hope this helps,
not Simon

Zero GT Mazda(1.8LVVT) ordered Nov 9 '15, arrived Apr 15 '16,

January 3, 2018
7:12 pm
Avatar
Mitch
Gloucester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 406
Member Since:
April 18, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Good find 'not Simon' 😉 Wonder why it didn't come up in my search?

Thanks, Ill pass that info to the person that comes to do my set up. Would be useful if anyone had a working copy of the link on the other page?

January 3, 2018
7:21 pm
Avatar
Marlin
Willits, California, USA
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 178
Member Since:
July 30, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It is just a picture of the side of a car with lift points A&B shown. I have a copy but no way to post to forum 🙁

Check your goolge + account, posted there. Still love your water dip.

Zero GT Mazda(1.8LVVT) ordered Nov 9 '15, arrived Apr 15 '16,

January 3, 2018
8:11 pm
Avatar
Weazel134
Bedford
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 17
Member Since:
September 15, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Ok so that’s suspension height and the tracking covered. Any idea what the desired camber angle is?

January 3, 2018
8:33 pm
Avatar
Marlin
Willits, California, USA
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 178
Member Since:
July 30, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Try these. I collect data but my car is still up on the build stand.
http://www.gbsownersclub.co.uk.....-settings/
http://www.rhocar.org/index.ph.....opic=43171
http://www.rhocar.org/index.ph.....opic=35445

No warranty expressed or implied. Use at your own risk. Standard disclaimer here in the USA.
Marlin

Zero GT Mazda(1.8LVVT) ordered Nov 9 '15, arrived Apr 15 '16,

January 4, 2018
10:37 am
Avatar
Mitch
Gloucester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 406
Member Since:
April 18, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Marlin said
It is just a picture of the side of a car with lift points A&B shown. I have a copy but no way to post to forum 🙁

Check your goolge + account, posted there. Still love your water dip.  

Ah perfect, thanks.13

January 4, 2018
1:44 pm
Avatar
Simon
GBS Technical
Admin
Forum Posts: 2174
Member Since:
August 9, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Did not look at the forum for one night and you all get up to mischief.

Question we must ask FIRST

Ford or Mazda, they are NOT the same
Pre or post IVA, a factor for both, but more so for the Mazda.
Which dampers
wide or narrow.
ANY mods from a standard factory car.

Suspension and its geometry, or lack of, causes more discussion than is actually helpful, especially on some sites. Totally forget advise that comes from the Knowledgeable? If they do not own a Zero, of the same donor, dampers, tyres, chassis, mods, weight of driver, weight of passenger if fitted, amount of fuel, they can not advise on your car.

There are NO hard and fast set of figures that will suit all cars, all drivers, OR all uses.

There are basics, and those changed in the years I was at GBS. I note, without reading it all that my 2014 post referred to on here says 110 and 120 ride height, later I would advise 120, 130, but possibly not on the Ford if you are running driver only or if you and your partner are not weight challenged.

Have to go back to work so will address questions this evening.

Weasel134 if you can answer the above questions I will give you the base, and what to look out for. this evening.

January 4, 2018
3:48 pm
Avatar
Weazel134
Bedford
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 17
Member Since:
September 15, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hi Simon

i have a ford based 2011 Zero with the Gaz suspension. post IVA, narrow body. no modifications.

thanks Dan

January 4, 2018
7:20 pm
Avatar
Simon
GBS Technical
Admin
Forum Posts: 2174
Member Since:
August 9, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

OK

Tyre pressures 18 psi all around
height 120 130, but you may want to take it down by 5 mm if you hear a knocking noise just behind you.
screw damper adjusters all the way in, and count the clicks whilst screwing them out. half the number of clicks, screw the adjust full in and then out the number of clicks you came to.

front camber at approx 1.5 degree negative, track to parallel or slightly toe in, rears are adjustable with shims, but we need to know where it sits before going into detail of how to do that.

The above is the basics, the occupants are a big percentage of the overall weight of the vehicle so you will have a big effect on how she will perform. road test and start winding the dampers on/off, the wheels need to react to the road, hard suspension is not your fried on such a light vehicle, but you do want the damper to stop wheel bounce. so it is trial and error till it suits you.

Does this make sense?

January 4, 2018
8:42 pm
Avatar
Mitch
Gloucester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 406
Member Since:
April 18, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Much difference for a pre-iva car?

Ford based, Gaz suspension, narrow body, No mods.

I weigh about 86-88Kgs normally but have a few Xmas kilos to shift. Normally there will be just me in - occasionally another similarly sized adult or a small 10 year old nephew.

January 4, 2018
8:57 pm
Avatar
Simon
GBS Technical
Admin
Forum Posts: 2174
Member Since:
August 9, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Can I add an apology to anyone who was offended by my above post, it was not my intention, but I fear it may have.

I know that I go on about the information available out there, but I have spent a lot of time, and charged a lot of money, correcting some of it, but equally I have always tried to show appreciation for those that do spend there leisure time giving out that information, it is well intended, none of them do it to cause a problem only to help.

All I have ever asked is that you filter it a little and look at everything with critical eyes, and that also included mine. I have given advice only to find I am talking about different setup to the one the recipient has.

I have said many times if people would like a detailed explanation I will gladly give it, given time. I to offer this in my leisure time, and there will be a time when my information will be out of date, I knew of the Mk5 Zero before I left, but I understand, only hearsay, that this is for in house builds now, and the kit will remain the same, with progressive modifications over time, as with the Zero during my time at the company.

This could have change since my last visit.

Anyway sorry again.

January 4, 2018
9:10 pm
Avatar
Weazel134
Bedford
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 17
Member Since:
September 15, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Simon

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. And I don’t think you need to apologise whatsoever. You knowledge is undoubtedly top notch.

Thanks again.

Dan

January 4, 2018
9:30 pm
Avatar
Simon
GBS Technical
Admin
Forum Posts: 2174
Member Since:
August 9, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Mitch said
Much difference for a pre-iva car?

Ford based, Gaz suspension, narrow body, No mods.

I weigh about 86-88Kgs normally but have a few Xmas kilos to shift. Normally there will be just me in - occasionally another similarly sized adult or a small 10 year old nephew.  

To busy typing to notice you had posted, sorry.

You should not be on the road pre IVA but some do have private roads to try them on, they should be set, as a base, as above, but again I distinguish between Ford and Mazda donors. Unless stated advise is for your car

IVA, I always advised to set the suspension high, not high enough that the suspension does not move but higher than normal for road use. the reason was that I always took the vehicle by trailer, although the tilt body types cause no problems, most trailers use ramps, and you need the ground clearance to get them onto the travel bed.

The other reason is that all the test centres I have visited have four posters, with fairly steep on and off ramps, on a couple of occasions I have had to reverse up the off ramp, which at Nottingham was less steep, because the seat mount bolts grounded to a point that the wheels spun up.

The last and possibly most important thing is that the car has to go into two sets of rollers. The speedo test rollers only need the rear wheels in them and clearance is not normally a problem, although I had a Mev land on the chassis, which caused some problems with the machine sensing the correct speed output.

But the brake rollers tend to be deep and if driven into them by the unwary the sump can hit the concrete. It sound awful and no one needs to buy a new race line.

So lift them high. If you are driving to the test, just be careful, the test itself has minimal driving. The test does differ slightly from test centre to test centre so I can not say they always test everything in the same way, but Nottingham did start checking that the vehicle would at least try to self centre if the steering was let go when in a turn. Not a tight turn just off centre, they used the HGV turning circle painted outside the test lanes

The Ford will generally do this, the only real thing to watch for is stiff columns, a problem with any second hand parts, and over tightening the rack U clamp, which can nip the rack. the Mazda can suffer the same, but it can have a tendency to turn into lock rather than pull straight, If you notice this on yours post, I have a trick that worked for me when encountered.

January 4, 2018
9:34 pm
Avatar
Simon
GBS Technical
Admin
Forum Posts: 2174
Member Since:
August 9, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Weazel134 said
Simon

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. And I don’t think you need to apologise whatsoever. You knowledge is undoubtedly top notch.

Thanks again.

Dan  

Thanks, but typing again when you posted, new years resolution, reduce long winded explanation unless asked Smile

January 5, 2018
7:30 pm
Avatar
Mitch
Gloucester
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 406
Member Since:
April 18, 2015
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Weazel134 said
Simon

Thanks for the info, much appreciated. And I don’t think you need to apologise whatsoever. You knowledge is undoubtedly top notch.

Thanks again.

Dan  

I agree, nothing at all to apologise for. Can’t even see what you’re referring to.

Forum Timezone: Europe/London

Most Users Ever Online: 96

Currently Online:
8 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Members Birthdays
sp_BirthdayIcon
Today None
Upcoming None

Top Posters:

nelmo: 568

Mitch: 406

TOPCATNO6: 336

NickMilbourn: 299

RichardL: 206

Graterham: 205

Foxtrottransit: 196

michaelhopps: 183

Marlin: 178

2ofus: 169

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 2

Members: 6310

Moderators: 0

Admins: 4

Forum Stats:

Groups: 2

Forums: 17

Topics: 1404

Posts: 8558

Newest Members:

rosalindtp4, timothybm18, joannafc11, Davidspene, cherigl11, vickiemw3, RogttRiz, jesussp3, blanchens18, lee.blandford.78Oi

Administrators: dijitul: 2, MidsZero: 314, Simon: 2174, Ruth Hall: 11