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Hot hot fuel
April 7, 2018
8:29 pm
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Andi
Leicester
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Does anyone else get hot fueling problems?
I have the Zetec and GBS plenum with the swirl pot under the headers (I suspect here is the problem).
The fuel gets so hot that the fuel tank in the boot is hot enough to fry eggs on on a hot day. And in conditions like this I have to always ensure the tank is no less than half full, otherwise it will splutter to a halt.
I have wrapped the headers and I am about to wrap the swirl pot. Failing this I will have to relocate it elsewhere. Yell

April 7, 2018
10:58 pm
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Simon
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STOP

There is no need to wrap anything, if the fuel inside is getting to hot it will only expatiate the problem.

What symptoms do you have? what effect on the running?

hot fuelling is a known problem with some systems, not the plenum, but it has some specific symptoms, do they match?

we need to know yours.

April 7, 2018
11:01 pm
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Mitch
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Interesting fault! How did you find it? I haven’t touched the tank or swirl pot after driving but as soon as the DVLA come back to me and it’s legal I’ll have a feel.

April 8, 2018
12:55 am
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Simon
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sorry, that sounds a little perverse.

April 8, 2018
11:50 am
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nelmo
Surrey
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That is weird - I assumed you meant hot-starting problems but literally hot fuel? Never heard of that... How do you know the tank is so hot? Mine is covered with carpet and foam so I'd never feel it and I've never known my swirl pot be hot.

I'm sure it isn't helping with the swirl pot under the headers - why did you put it there? Wrong side of the engine from the injectors so you must have long fuel pipes and it must be quite awkward to run them round to those injectors.

I don't know about wrapping but moving the swirl pot sounds like the best solution but not the simplest of jobs, I realise.

April 8, 2018
11:52 am
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Andi
Leicester
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Ok, so the symptoms are....
Engine spluttering then dying.
Not starting until its cooled down or fresh cool petrol put in.
Always on a hot day
Always when fuel is 1/4 tank or less
Always after a fast run and most times after idling in traffic afterwards.
Fuel tank is really hot, almost too hot to keep your hand on.

April 8, 2018
11:57 am
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Andi
Leicester
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nelmo said
That is weird - I assumed you meant hot-starting problems but literally hot fuel? Never heard of that... How do you know the tank is so hot? Mine is covered with carpet and foam so I'd never feel it and I've never known my swirl pot be hot.

I'm sure it isn't helping with the swirl pot under the headers - why did you put it there? Wrong side of the engine from the injectors so you must have long fuel pipes and it must be quite awkward to run them round to those injectors.

I don't know about wrapping but moving the swirl pot sounds like the best solution but not the simplest of jobs, I realise.  

The tank has no covering in the boot since i bought the car so I don`t want to keep the heat in there either with carpets. I even took my car rain cover out which helped a bit.
The car was bought so came all set up as it is.
This problem has only happened about 4 times, but it`s 4 times too much.

April 8, 2018
12:17 pm
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nelmo
Surrey
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Ah right, well I don't feel so bad now in saying that whoever built that made a bad decision Cool

Depending on your mechanical abilities, it's not too hard a job to move the swirl pot. The hardest bit will be having to re-route the pipes from the tank as I imagine they will have been run on the passenger side of the central tunnel whereas you'd be best to move them to the drivers side of the tunnel (not essential but you're probably going to have to make them a different length anyway).

You'll probably have to move the HP fuel pump as well, assuming it is also on that side of the engine bay? Then it's just new pipe runs from pump to injectors.

All fairly simple at the build stage but a bit awkward on a completed car.

I'm pretty sure that would solve your problem but listen to Simon first - he's the real expert.

April 8, 2018
12:44 pm
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Blue
Harlow
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OK I had exactly the same problem when I first built my zero the fuel was so hot that it was bubbling in the tank and spitting out of the filler ect to the point I left it in the middle of the yard thinking it was gonna go bang !!
OK I knew it would not because fuel boiling ain't a problem but paranoid and all that
OK I too have my swell pot under the headers the same as you
I wrapped the headers up the the edge of the bonnet inside engine bay and put heat reflect materal around and on top of swell pot -touch wood never had the problem return and I've done 1000s of miles now

April 8, 2018
12:44 pm
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Simon
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Poor starting when hot is a classic sign of Hot Soak, the heat from the engine rises and can boil the fuel in the injector feed rail. and this is NOT just a kit problem most cars suffer from this at times, there was a mod issued by Peugeot for the 406 carburettor vehicles years ago which measured under body temperature and switch the cooling fan on to move the hot air around. VAG fit after run fans, and I suspect other manufacturers do to.

The problem became more pronounced when leaded fuel was dropped, and some of the cheaper fuel brands are more prone.

The problem causes the vehicle to churn over before it starts after being left stood after being hot for about 10 to 20 minutes, Not starting at all, or cutting out would point to another problem. The fuel cools when evaporated or moved around the fuel system, I would not expect it to get hot enough to evaporate with the pumps running.

Things in build that can cause problems.

Cooling fan rotation, it should pull from front to rear.
Swirl pot position, should be on induction side of engine compartment
fuel line run, should be in tunnel from tank to swirl pot
fuel run in engine bay, should run from swirl pot along right hand out chassis rail, around to fuel rail, from rail it should exit art rear and down to swirl pot
Fuel pressure, the Plenum uses the Ford pressure regulator, but I have seen them fitted with a second regulator as well.
Check your fuel cap, what colour is the plastic on the inside of the cap?
Power map is very rich and can over fuel on cranking, not what you want with the engine at normal running temp.
A faulty pump, particularly the HP can over heat, the fuel is used to cool it but it could heat the fuel if faulty.

a bit to be going on with, let us know how you go.

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